Q&A with Incoming Massachusetts Education Secretary Steve Zrike 

Jane: I asked you to consider the question “What do educators need to succeed?”  

Steve: It’s interesting, this year [the district’s] teacher advisory group focused on what makes for quality professional development. It’s been an action project of sorts; they’ve been reacting to a series of articles, podcasts, and videos about professional development. A few issues have come up repeatedly. One is the importance of personalization, that is, having individualized experiences that speak to their own differentiated learning needs. They’ve also spoken a lot about the importance of learning best practices from colleagues.

But what really struck me most this year about what they say they need is time to observe their colleagues in practice. They would like more flexibility during the school day, to visit colleagues who have a track record of moving kids forward.

I think it’s important for instructional leadership teams at schools to design professional learning, making sure that teachers have a voice in what the school-based professional development looks like. This includes the time of day – sometimes the end of the day is hard because it’s been a long day at school. It could happen as part of common planning time if that time is built into the school day, or before school. But having full days where kids are not in the building to learn is really important, Being in community with one another is something that teachers feel is important, just like we talk about the importance of having a sense of belonging for kids.  Professional learning and creating a sense of belonging for them, I think is really  something that teachers long for. 

Jane: You’re saying that in order for students to feel a sense of belonging, adults must feel that as well?

Steve: What I have observed in my time as a school and district leader is how important the teacher experience is and how connected it is to the school-based experience. The culture at each school is what keeps teachers invigorated and motivated or not, right? You can find excellent schools in districts that are not that strong, and then you can find not so excellent schools in districts that are strong. 

The nucleus of change and the experience for educators is so defined by what happens in the school in which they work, the leadership of the school. That means more than just the principal, it is the entire team, the instructional leadership team, the teacher leaders, and the way that educators interact with one another. It’s the priorities, the values, the sense of whether we’re rowing in the same direction or not, right? That’s why I think it’s so important that each school receives the support and guidance to be a community that thrives. The goal is to build the capacity of the individual schools, not through mandates or orders from on high, but rather creating a community that is student-centered, that allows adults to take risks. The goal is to build the capacity of the individual schools, as a place where educators can really grow and build their skillsets as educators. 

I also think that principals must believe in the power of developmental work. You need a leader who is adult learner-centered. I think that’s a critical component of creating the conditions for educators to be successful. We’re always working in a field where the needs of kids are changing. We lived through a pandemic. We have to be able to pivot and nobody has all the answers. 

Early in my career, I was trying to hire unicorns, people who were ready on Day 1 and had all the bells and whistles.The reality is that it doesn’t exist. It didn’t exist then, and it certainly doesn’t exist now. So when educators commit to this profession, you have to create the conditions that allow people to grow and develop. They’re willing to do hard work, but they’re not willing to do impossible work. And so in order for them to feel successful, the conditions have to allow them to develop and grow in their practice.

These are the schools that see the most success, have the highest retention rates, and have educators who are committed to being there long term. 

Jane: I remember when you came back from a Transcend gathering and said: “I used to be all about outcomes, and now I’m really about the learning experience.”  Can you unpack that a bit?

Steve:  It’s important to create places of innovation in schools, where kids are engaged and excited about learning. That’s where you’ll see improved student outcomes and that’s also the path to re-energize educators. In my experience, they want to be part of a movement, where they see the impact on their kids. Teachers want to work in places that allow kids to feel that way about learning.

That was one of the unintended or unexpected consequences of the Collins Middle School Pilot Program. I knew that we were focused on making the learning more engaging for young people, but they had no idea what it would do for the educators who have been burned out by being in schools where they felt like they were running against a brick wall with their kids. 

And not because of lack of effort, not because of lack of preparation, not because of lack of commitment, but just, the design of the school, the design of the curriculum, the design of the schedule wasn’t set up in a way where kids would feel that level of enthusiasm. When you can teach and you know it’s making a marked impact on the experience of young people that gets you right back up the next morning, and excited about coming to work. That’s what it means to create the right conditions; people make a mistake thinking that’s soft and squishy.   

Getting it right involves intentionality, a school-wide vision around engagement, clarity around how you use high quality curriculum materials. I also believe in assessments, but the assessments will take care of themselves if kids are educated in conditions where they’re really enthusiastic about the content that they’re being presented with. 

Jane: This is thrilling, personally, for me to hear, and it makes me excited to think that you will share your philosophy about learning environments as the Secretary of Education.  Something else I’ve noticed about your leadership: you are not afraid to do messy things.  

Steve:  Yes, and it’s hard, right? Because people want results yesterday, and sometimes it takes time to build the infrastructure for [an innovation] to take hold. I would consider myself someone who likes to initiate change, but sometimes too rapidly, and then it doesn’t stick, and then it dissipates over time when the leaders change. And so, I think there’s a balance, right, between doing something bold, and then making sure that you’re building a model that can sustain over time, that can outlast your tenure. 

That’s something I’ve learned over time, having made the mistake of having folks be too dependent on me as a leader in a school, or too dependent on just a few people moving the needle, rather than a critical mass of people who can make sure the change can outlast the particular leaders. You have to be prepared to incubate, try something out with a small group of kids and a small group of teachers. That’s hard for me personally and it’s hard for school committee members, and it can be hard for city officials who really want to make sure that the innovation reaches all kids as soon as possible. 

Jane: It’s not easy to manage the expectations of so many different stakeholders.

Steve: It can be very hard politically to manage, but over time you’re strengthening your understanding of what works and doesn’t, and then you’re much better positioned for when you’re ready to bring it to scale. And that’s where I think we struggle. I’ve had to manage my expectations about how quickly we can bring something to scale. It’s a lesson that I will bring with me in my new role: how do you incentivize people who are ready to go, where there are already pockets of excellence that need more resources and more support, and that need some cover to keep going. We must create the conditions in this state that will allow for R& D to happen. Sometimes [the innovation] won’t work, and we have to be okay with that. Maybe your accountability data will suffer a little bit in the short term, but we are creating something better and bigger for kids in the long term. 

Jane:  How do you build public will for that, Steve? 

Steve: Yeah, it’s hard. In the job of a school leader or district leader, you always have to politically map who are the players that have the most at stake in any initiative that you’re rolling out. You have to know who they are and you have to nurture those relationships. You must have an explanation of why you’re doing what you’re doing, and you have to take the time to bring people along who are in strategic roles, whether that be teacher leadership, union leadership, parents, student leaders, district leaders. You need buy-in from people before you take on a big change. When you’re making change that feels different for people and is unlike anything they’ve experienced before, there’s always fear and anxiety. I’ve learned that I just can’t will my way to getting things done because I think it’s right or I believe that it’s going to work for kids. You have to make sure that key stakeholders are well informed as you move through the process. In my new role, it will be important to identify the bright spots across the state and find the players who might be ready for these kinds of tiny experiments that can grow into something bigger. We’ve got to create the conditions that allow for genuine innovation to occur. 

Jane: What else is at the top of your agenda for Massachusetts? 

Steve:  I think we need to get past what COVID left us; we can’t be mired in recovery only, which has taken up a lot of focus, understandably. Now we must decide who we want to become, how we should model some of the best practices, especially those that address some of the persistent inequities that we have seen in the state, particularly around outcomes for Latino and black students, for low income students, and for particular districts in the state. 

Jane: What other issues will you prioritize?

Steve: I wouldn’t have taken this role if I didn’t believe in the Governor’s priorities around expansion of early education, which is significant. I believe in accessible and high quality early education for kids.  We need to ensure that kids have a strong foundation so that they can begin to do the more exciting work that happens outside the walls of the classroom.

I also think early college and career-connected learning from middle school onward should be a priority so that students are driven to make choices on their own around what they want their futures to be, rather than us telling them or pigeonholing them.

And, of course graduation requirements – rethinking what our expectations are for students is a real opportunity to build something better for our young people as they move on to higher education, careers or the military. 

Jane: Any parting ideas or advice for Power of Place?

Steve: I think it’s worth thinking about how [Power of Place] can collaborate with districts around building a vision for professional learning that lives within the school district. I always value the materials you put in front of us; they are really useful and help facilitate discussions that help districts build solid systems internally, rather than externally, with teacher leaders who have a lot to say.  

I also think there’s an opportunity for you to work closely with the academic teams and with teachers to take the kinds of learning experiences you have designed for educators and help them build something similar in their own systems. Creating meaningful and high-quality professional development for everyone is hard for many districts. It’s a service you provide. 

Jane:  Thanks for the vote of confidence, Steve. We wish you all the best in the next chapter – and we promise to keep in touch about how Power of Place can partner with you to support educators across the Commonwealth.